Request: Ateenia

[Ateenia]

Nation in Eurth: Ateenia (Kingdom of Ateenia)

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Capital name: Atha
Capital location: On the coastline, on the smallest river.
Factbook link: https://iiwiki.us/wiki/Ateenia
Newsroom link:

Culture: Ateenian (Based off of Norse culture with unique added features.)
Climate: Subarctic or Boreal climate with freezing winters and warm summers.
Location:

The black border if possible, red border if black is over the limit or not possible. black dot is capital Atha. (if there is a need to further discuss then DM me in discord (*cencored*#7122)
 

History: The first tribesmen and hunters arrived to Ateenian lands from south, around 10,000 years ago and the first settlements began to grow along the rivers. Later on, settlers arrived to the northern coasts where they began settleing more intensivly and in matter of millenias, they made the northern coasts most populated in whole modern Ateenia. Ateenia as a kingdom itself was founded in 118. Before that, the Ateenian people were split into various clans, tribes, earldoms, jarldoms and lesser kingdoms. When Ateenia united it began using its first kings birth year as the start of Ateenian calender. Early Ateenians were renowned for their art of shipbuilding for being able to build strong ships that could sail both on rivers and oceans, thus giving them the ability to raid distant lands, which is the main reason Ateenian coastline is so populated, many people moved to the coastlines to be able to take part of raids.

Statistics: Population - 0   GDP - 2    Land Area - 2

Edited March 27, 2021 by Ateenia (see edit history)

[Prymont]

Hello neighbour!

I've a few things to comment on, which we'll keep on the forums for transparency.

I went ahead and calculated your area on Google Eurth which comes out at roughly 301,886km2, which is well within the bracket for 2 Land Area points.

 

Now, we do have an issue regarding your climate and capital location. 

Firstly, your climate is entirely subarctic. This means long, very cold winters and short, cool summers. The southern and western parts of Prymont are classified as 'humid continental', which has the four distinct seasons and is generally more liveable than subarctic. The vast majority (>95%) of my population resides in this climate. 

This brings me to the next point of your capital location. I don't think it's at all realistic to place a capital that far north. My capital Rettenmyr is in the south of the country. If you take a look at Norway, Finland, Sweden, or Iceland, you'll see that their capitals are also southerly. Furthermore, the Argic Ocean is frozen for most of the year and requires an icebreaking fleet after a string of incidents. Perhaps this isn't clear judging just by the map, but having a capital city located on the coast of a frozen ocean is rather unusual. 

To combat these issues, I'd suggest having your capital as far south as possible, as well as the majority of your population. Having a country survive in a subarctic climate isn't unrealistic, but it won't be easy. 

This isn't anything personal - as your neighbour I'd want you to do well and have a good time in Eurth. I've learned myself over the past 4 years that having a country this far north has few benefits. It's worth seriously considering if this is what you're looking for.

[Ateenia]

Summers in siberian like climate are actualy very warm due to it being the closest part of the planet towards the sun during summer.

As for the ocean being frozen for over half of the year, is what i was looking for.

The capital is located there due to the seas being sailable half of the year (allbeit still dangerous due to floating ice) and due to historic reasons where people settled those areas for it being inhabited by seals who get hunted.

As for land size, i see i have expanding room so i wish to include the small lake on my southern border, inside my borders, for certain reasons.

[Iverica]

51 minutes ago, Ateenia said:

Summers in siberian like climate are actualy very warm due to it being the closest part of the planet towards the sun during summer.

As for the ocean being frozen for over half of the year, is what i was looking for.

The capital is located there due to the seas being sailable half of the year (allbeit still dangerous due to floating ice) and due to historic reasons where people settled those areas for it being inhabited by seals who get hunted.

As for land size, i see i have expanding room so i wish to include the small lake on my southern border, inside my borders, for certain reasons.

Sure, I've seen the climate data of places like; Tiksi, Russia and Tromso, Normay and I've got to agree with that statement. Though given how harsh the winters are and how difficult agriculture, year-round travel, and industry might be there, would it be reasonable to assume your capital is likely a low-population centre? Perhaps selected for political, historical, or strategic reasons. 

Likely, I'd assume you would have higher population centres further south?

[Ateenia]

12 minutes ago, Iverica said:

Sure, I've seen the climate data of places like; Tiksi, Russia and Tromso, Normay and I've got to agree with that statement. Though given how harsh the winters are and how difficult agriculture, year-round travel, and industry might be there, would it be reasonable to assume your capital is likely a low-population centre? Perhaps selected for political, historical, or strategic reasons. 

Likely, I'd assume you would have higher population centres further south?

The Capital is very sparsely populated compared to other cities around Eurth and even compared to IRL wurld but it would still be one of the biggest cities in Ateenia due to historical reasons and political reasons. The main economic sectors of that city would be services and industry and such.

Overall the most populated areas in Ateenia would be the rivers, the capital and the southern area of Ateenia.

[Orioni]

@Ateenia Culturally I think the location you drew would work quite well. 

6 hours ago, Prymont said:

This brings me to the next point of your capital location. I don't think it's at all realistic to place a capital that far north. My capital Rettenmyr is in the south of the country. If you take a look at Norway, Finland, Sweden, or Iceland, you'll see that their capitals are also southerly. Furthermore, the Argic Ocean is frozen for most of the year and requires an icebreaking fleet after a string of incidents. Perhaps this isn't clear judging just by the map, but having a capital city located on the coast of a frozen ocean is rather unusual. 

@Prymont makes a good point there. I had a look at the latest map version to include some indication of pack ice. The map from December 20th, 2020 does show a little bit of the extent. The city location you drew is right on the edge there. Climate and biomes are not my speciality though.

The location is at the same latitude as RL central Greenland or Nova Zemlya in Russia. Further north you'll find RL Svalbard. Iceland is a bit further south.

Something that could work is bending your claim towards the lake regions to your south. When going on Viking, the norsemen did sometimes cross land to reach another river system. You can then have a traditional 'summer capital' at the river in the north, and a secondary 'winter capital' in the south when the Argic Ocean has more and more ice.

Just my two cents.

[Ateenia]

hmm that actualy is somewhat good point. If possible i wish to expand my claim to territory between prymonts border and the yellow border. (hopefuly the cartographer makes the borders as close to being like on the picture as possible. i tried to follow land formations with those borders.)

[Orioni]

On 3/28/2021 at 6:47 PM, Ateenia said:

that actualy is somewhat good point. If possible i wish to expand my claim to territory between prymonts border and the yellow border.

Thank you @Ateenia for being open to suggestions. 🙂 

On 3/28/2021 at 6:47 PM, Ateenia said:

hopefuly the cartographer makes the borders as close to being like on the picture as possible. i tried to follow land formations with those borders.

Yes, copying the borders from this image is not too difficult. So you can rest assured it will look very much like this.

[Xio]

Hello!
I've read over this post and land area appears to be suitable, no issue on that part. And I am sure you understand that agriculture will be difficult within Ateenia, the maximum extent of profitable agriculture in the region would be the Dwb climate. Much of your country will be Hemiboreal which means long, dark, harsh, winters. However this is not a death sentence, with the right timing and with strict and fast harvesting, cereals, rapeseeds, and grass crops are possible. Your flatter terrain will also favour the crops compared to the ruggedness of Scandinavia. It is highly likely in the past, your people were capable of permanent living in the far north but suffered from the occasional famine and societal collapse if not for a powerful unifying state or city in your southern coast. In my opinion I would follow what Orioni said, and historically have a summer capital in the DwB region - which kept your nation's societies from repeatedly collapsing - but also a winter capital to explain the existence of Atha which outlasted your summer capital as raiding became more lucrative.

(Not actual borders)

Regarding sea ice, you won't actually have much. Dfc regions rarely possess coastal sea ice and instead ET and EF possess ice sheets and sea ice. ET (the lighter grey) will have seasonal ice, whereas ET will have permanent sea ice. So year-round raiding is entirely feasible.

All in all your placement is perfectly fine if @Prymont is okay with it.

 

 

[Ateenia]

2 minutes ago, Metztlitlaca said:

Hello!
I've read over this post and land area appears to be suitable, no issue on that part. And I am sure you understand that agriculture will be difficult within Ateenia, the maximum extent of profitable agriculture in the region would be the Dwb climate. Much of your country will be Hemiboreal which means long, dark, harsh, winters. However this is not a death sentence, with the right timing and with strict and fast harvesting, cereals, rapeseeds, and grass crops are possible. Your flatter terrain will also favour the crops compared to the ruggedness of Scandinavia. It is highly likely in the past, your people were capable of permanent living in the far north but suffered from the occasional famine and societal collapse if not for a powerful unifying state or city in your southern coast. In my opinion I would follow what Orioni said, and historically have a summer capital in the DwB region - which kept your nation's societies from repeatedly collapsing - but also a winter capital to explain the existence of Atha which outlasted your summer capital as raiding became more lucrative.

(Not actual borders)

Regarding sea ice, you won't actually have much. Dfc regions rarely possess coastal sea ice and instead ET and EF possess ice sheets and sea ice. ET (the lighter grey) will have seasonal ice, whereas ET will have permanent sea ice. So year-round raiding is entirely feasible.

All in all your placement is perfectly fine if @Prymont is okay with it.

 

 

I am infact aware of the conditions there (i picked the area for that specific reason) and yeh i also realized not a while back that i wouldnt even have much seasonal ice there. As for the food source throughout history, they have relied mostly on hunting animals and fishing with agriculture only being a small extra for them. As for Atha, the reason it is and has been capital was infact because the founder of Ateenia was born and died in that city (which at the time was only recently evolving into a town). Alot of the population centers would still have been and still are in south around the southern river and on the southern coast.

The harsh conditions there are actualy one of the reasons the population is only around 4 million.

And yes i know agriculture is certainly a small part of my economy there which is why Ateenia relies heavily on trade and national resources making up for the lack of arable land.