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Expansion/Removal: Fleur de Lys

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Nation in NS Europa Region: Fleur de Lys

Current Name: République de Fleur de Lys

Future Name: République Lysienne

Current Flag:


Future Flag:


Current Location:


Future Location (expansion in this case):


Current Capital Name: Lyrie

Future Capital Name: Cœur

Current and Future Capitals location are indicated on the map above.


Factbook link: Current one. Under construction one, which shall succeed if the expansion is approved, and shall see the changes RPed except for the removal of Bellefaye, Neaumanin, Danebourg and Mauvin (which, just disappear?). 

Newsroom link: Currently APL. This (the name, stance and status of the APL newspaper) is however open to change or some updates in function of the RP


OOC Context: I have decided to kill in the egg the idea of an Union Pan-Républicaine (and de facto the nations added for such RP) for two main purposes: First one, being that I’ve never been good at RPing large nations or military (I mean nations of +25 millions in demographics), this isn’t something in my nature (had experimented couple times, but I do not feel comfortable), Second given the feeling of some people of “unfairness” even if the application have been approved, which I shall understand and prefer therefore to limit this.

I, however, given my most active diplomatic network (at least before May) had a bad after-taste, given the lack of demographics to support such active military operations overseas (deployment in Afropa with Iverican means, Operations in Ahrana, supporting ISTC logistics where needed, helicopters active in Adaptus navy patrolling near Derthalen, 2 Fighter Squadrons along Patrol Planes being deployed in Sunset Sea Islands), as I find it weird for a minor nation (in both economic and demographics definitions) to handle that many things, I felt the need to “upgrade” (that’s from where the idea of the Union was born, add to this a launch for “fulfilling the map holes” of the continent of Europa, which seems to no longer be the rule). As you may have seen in my factbook, currently the Lysian population is of about 7 528 709 citizens for a total GDP of 565 338 287 519,00 USD. The expansion would consist of making it pass to 20 372 959 citizens (increasing 2,71 time the population) and a total GDP of 1 179 648 314 441,35 (increasing 2,09 time the GDP) making overall the GDP per capita go down (of 19 000 USD, or at 77,11% of the current one).

Given this, if the expansion was to be approved, the République Sœurs would also have to be removed definitely from the map (Bellefaye, Neaumanin, Danebourg and Mauvin) as two of them (Danebourg and Mauvin) would be used to explain and RP the expansion of Fleur de Lys.

But most importantly, this shall give me a fair amount of fresh air. Why? Simply as, in RP, one of Mécra’s motivation (and mine) also is to reform the Republic, which as you probably have read in the Crisis in the Assemblée Nationale thread, is pretty bureaucratic and long to RP, something I was enjoying before, but I feel I need more free move and politic action (rather then everything passing through the Assemblée Nationale at a moment or another, which is basically the case today in Fleur de Lys’ working, fun fact, I retook French 3rd Republic working principles, and this may explain why it ended up badly), and much less characters if possible.

This shall naturally happen with @Cristina and @Magnaeus approval, as also (I suppose I need approval?) the removal of the 4 Republics.


History: How shall it pass? First of all, if Seylos “A Great Europan Collapse” shall not be applied, the scenario shall remain as the following (more or less, details to be adapted after naturally or in function of demands/protests):

Following the failed negotiations of the Union, the République of Mauvin, having took the leadership of the provisory Union (with Protectrice Maréchal) would be much displeased, and see the main reasons as this failure Mécra’s (which was the one at the origin of the idea an Union) opposition (which he got, given the fact he haven’t been elected Protecteur, unlike what most had predicted). Violents exchanges also had happened during the Congrès, making in the end, the 5 nations, more separated then before. The République of Mauvin, willing to exercise some pressure on Fleur de Lys, given also a strange aerospace violation by an unknown flying object, which was coming from Fleur de Lys, would impose a suspension of Mauvin uranium exports to Fleur de Lys. Fleur de Lys, having 3 months of reserve, have the time to see how it may go, however given Mécra’s revanchard after-taste, shall make everything to push for sizing the Mauvin uranium mines by the Lysian military, which is exactly what shall happen following a series of rising tensions and events. However, once occupied, the mines shall not only be managed by the Lysians, but to also ensure complete independence from foreign power, the territory they reside in, shall be annexed.

Second, south of present-day Danebourg. Given great strikes, which have been introduced by Président du Conseil Crolly, socialism is on the rise, as Rostelsa, which is conservative, refuse to give up, leading to great manifestations against the current Government, and calling for general reelections, along reforms. To stabilise, the Danebourgeois Government, having similar stances then RL Germany when coming to military and little police force (as after all, if you remember correctly, it is also the only of the 5 Républiques to do a budget surplus) call its neighbours to send police officers to maintain order, something which obviously Neaumanin shall deny, while Fleur de Lys do send indeed troops. Following a series of rising tensions once more, leading to a total destabilisation of the Government, the Lysians, in order to secure more the territory the Danebourgeois had given them to secure because of the lack of means they have, shall send the military to enforce law in the region. Given the new situation, of a destabilised Government and Mécra with full powers as Dictateur in Fleur de Lys, shall de facto proclaim the République Lysienne and annex those territories, along reforming the entirety of the administration system.

The RP, shall pursue itself mainly in the thread “Crisis in the Assemblée Nationale“ even if references of those changes shall probably be done in other threads (including, newspapers, diplomatic meetings etc.).


Edited by Fleur de Lys
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Note that I'm responding to this on my own personal terms, not within my position as a moderator.

As it stands, I do not think Fleur de Lys will be, under any circumstances, able to rejoin the community in a productive way.

  • It is clear that Fleur de Lys does not trust the new moderation staff, creating a situation in which it is not possible to properly work with him. These issues with the moderation team is something that I have also brought up in the mod cave. 
  • It is clear that Fleur de Lys does not enjoy the community and vice versa. The Discord is an active part of the OOC interaction within the community, hence why I feel comfortable mentioning it. We have all seen the difference of Fleur de Lys being part of it and when he is not.
  • Fleur de Lys has clearly shown a lack of respect towards members of the existing moderation staff both in his posts and in PMs. Taking into account that this was a member that he was normally very friendly with too, this is something that's a major red flag. There are rather minor examples on this forum with the real examples in the mod cave.
  • Fleur de Lys has shown a disregard for the wishes of other members that feel that he is a negative impact on their enjoyment and experience and has, instead of finding a middle ground or attempting to show that he isn't, repeatedly used snark and attacks. This simply solidifies the fact that members see him as a negative impact.
  • All of the above fosters a toxic community and it, along with other issues that have happened in the past, has made me come to the conclusion that Fleur de Lys as his personality is currently, is a toxic person in general.


As it clear that Fleur de Lys is unable to keep the honor to himself (I'm going to presume this idiom translates good enough into English), let me be clear: 

I do not want Fleur de Lys to return. Many members do not want Fleur de Lys to return. There is nothing to be gained from Fleur de Lys returning to this community except an increase in the levels of toxicity, more discussions and other people that aren't part of the problem going 'hmm, this is not worth the hassle' and either ending up leaving or becoming inactive. Am I saying Fleur de Lys is the only party at fault? No. But he is the worst one and the only one that has not shown progress but rather, in my opinion, regression.

Fleur de Lys, you are unwanted here by many members. Get the hint, leave before everyone here has a negative opinion of you. It's not 'being discredited' if what people are saying is true. A farmer farms, a politician lies and you're a toxic person being toxic. Maybe life in general is frustrating to you, maybe you lack genuine power at work or whatever the reason is for you to be this toxic, I hope this may be part of the wake-up call for you to change. I hope you do end up a better person in the end, as I hope all of us do, if not for now and here, then for the people that will follow. 

I believe you said that you were part of three other regions, enjoy them and enjoy those communities. Want a fourth? Put Fleur de Lys back in the New Warsaw Pact and RP there. This one isn't for you. And if that means giving you time to copy stuff you want to save and then deleting your entire existence from the region and map, that's just going to be the price in my opinion.

I'd rather help ten, twenty nations write new canon to replace mentions of you all by myself than have the community be subject to you and the levels of toxicity that you've carried ever since I've met you, again. People should be able to go on the discord and go on the forums and just have fun, be it through IC or OOC means, not worry if something they say may trigger a person to go ballistic.

I really, genuinely hope that this is the last time you'll attempt to be part of this community without it wanting you to be a part of it and just leave quietly, taking your things and going. I wish you the best, really. Grudges aren't healthy and everyone deserves a life that they are happy and comfortable in. 

So, goodbye. I hope you find what you need but it won't be here.





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Het Huisselant Variota
Factbook | Nasionale TeleSicht | Character list | Varinco

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To be clear, this have nothing to do with the expansion/removal, this is just the follow-up of the ISTC OOC Discussions.

@Sunset Sea Islands: Your compliments honour me. I agree that when I disagree about something, I can get pretty aggressive, which is why, for prohibiting myself such thing, I left the Discord, as I also put too much energy into debates when coming to the community. I find myself rather good at cooperation, only things that makes me most tedious, is that I have a very strict (and naturally debatable following your point of view) view on realism, and therefore have hard time to RP and cooperate with people I consider (I know that's a judgement) having made something not realistic. I personally have no issue (maybe they have secret issues with me, who knows) with you, Andalla, Orioni, Gallambria, Iverica, Cristina, Magnaeus, Derthalen (even if was pretty hot at the start), Mauridiviah and Variota (at least, I though, seems like I was wrong), and this non-exhaustive list of members. To be honest, only one I got myself really mad with is Prymont, and it is reciprocal following the numerous reactions of “sad” he made to my posts along our public exchanges. However it is true my communication can be raw, which again, is why I left the Discord. Willing me to return on the Discord (which was one of Prymont's demand) would be equal to have me, commenting and criticising everything I find non-realistic, and that is just the way how I work, so I prefer to remain out for now.


@Variota: I'd had appreciated to keep such talks for the ISTC OOC Discussions thread, which was more or less, all about this (where you may have expressed your opinion, but well, better to express it then to not express it), and where I clearly opened the possibility of leaving if people wished to (with the exception of Prymont which I already knew the answer naturally), as you quoted “Many members do not want Fleur de Lys to return.”, well, nobody except Prymont replied to my question, not even you (not a critic). I'd had very much enjoyed if you had jumped into the thread, and told so, it would have been a mark of respect, rather then there, after having let me time to get back to my RPs, plan the future along writing a new factbook, but as I said earlier, better now then never. :)

I also enjoy the fact that you differentiate your position of Moderator as simple Member (that's a compliment).

I disagree with your judgement “Fleur de Lys does not enjoy the community”, if I really did not enjoyed it, I wouldn't had kept RPing. I do not see also how I am “toxic”, if you may clarify with concrete cases (and yes, I've certainly been angry, just like other people around this table). As Sunset said, I can “throw a tantrum”, but other then that? I have been very crude effectively in the ISTC OOC Discussions, as effectively, I did not appreciated at all the Moderators trying to impose things which weren't explicited within rules (that's my interpretation, sorry if it wasn't the case, but that's how I took it, and it's in no case a disrespect to moderation), which is why I proposed to clarify how Membership worked in Europa in the thread, and note that nobody really took the idea, and laws/rules on that matter are implicit or inexistent, therefore can't be enforced. I'm somebody really good, yes really really good (how arrogant), but when there are clear rules. There weren't clear rules, so yes, I clearly opposed the fact that some stated (so I “opposed the Moderation” as you state) I had been inactive, as there is no clear rule on this (knowing also it was an “absence” without RP post for 40 days).

On the point “I do not trust the new moderation staff”, well, I admit it, I'd say most probably when coming to realism questions and to the debates we had in the past and given for instance a RP post I have discussed with some which considered as unrealistic too, but still remains, something I personally never saw happen, as generally Moderators enforce rules by talking with the person to edit the post content, or edit themselves if the person refuse to cooperate (that's just what I saw, and considered as normal). But now, I believe you don't have to care about my opinion as I'm no longer throwing a tantrum (yes, I really like this expression, didn't knew it before) on the regional Discord, so I'd see no issue.

I also don't follow you on the “repeatedly used snark and attacks”, when I was actually “defending” my position of having the right to dispose of my own nation.


For finishing, yes, not only I did not enjoyed insults thrown by Prymont to my person, but that would pass. However making a so called “joke” about the death of 113 people, yes, that's what I call a lack of respect. You may not enjoy the person's nationality you have in face of you, that is however no reason to make joke of such tragedy. Would be just like if somebody did a joke about 9/11 or Holocaust, totally inappropriate and shall never be tolerated.


There so, sorry for my answer, it's not well arranged, but I wrote as things went.

Edited by Fleur de Lys
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My response didn't require a response, only an action on your part. When I go online, I don't check every thread. Looking back when I was asked feedback by SSI is when I saw the thread. I'm not a member of the ISTC, so ISTC business does not interest me as much as other threads would. As for a mark of respect, do you really genuinely believe you deserve respect at the moment? I don't think so. Your attitude, the sole fact that you are so bloody dense or so bloody entitled to not leave says enough.

You want concrete cases? How about the many times you called me scum? I remember one time, I mentioned that De Gaulle was mentioned as the prototype of a certain version of dictator, something that I had read in a book. I even mentioned that I would look it up when I had the time. Didn't stop you from cursing me out before that, without reason, calling me every name under the sun. I remember multiple times when I thought 'Hmm, let's leave Europa alone for the day' because of you. You know why? Because you're a toxic person. You want a concrete case? I'm it. You have, on multiple occasions, ruined my enjoyment of this community. And don't get me wrong, I'm all for having a proper discussion, I'm understanding of things heating up. One thing I can tell you is that since you left, 9 out of 10 arguments, 9 out of 10 fights have stopped. And those that do happen? Easily solved.

Additionally, please f*ck off with the racism accusation. I have nothing against the French people in general, I have something against you in this case. Because you're a toxic person. And that's me keeping it civil. Honestly, the irony of this isn't lost on me. If you'd have been on the Discord, you would have been that I actually discussed it with Prymont and why it wasn't, in my eyes, acceptable. So, bravo. Two false accusations from you to me in one post.

Let me reiterate my original message:

Fleur de Lys, you are unwanted here by me. I can truly, genuinely say that if we would live in the same town, in the same social circles, if we knew each other in real life, I'd avoid you like the plague. You seem to be that special amount of arrogant, dense and entitled that makes a person absolutely unbearable to be with unless I watch my words and act 100% in agreement with your ideas, with your mindset. But here's the thing, right, we don't know each other in real life. There's no need for us to interact with each other, no need for me to keep on being friendly for the sake of mutual friends. So take the hint and go away. Be the good guy for once and leave. But I know better and presumably, you'll not leave but instead want to prove how you're not the bad guy, you just want yadayada. 

So let me put this situation in front of you: Let's say you rejoin, then what? My guess is that there are going to be members that will refuse to acknowledge you, I know I'm going to be one of them. You're not worth taking away my enjoyment from this region, not worth spending the time to handle. I've already told the modcave that I won't give my opinion on anything regarding moderation action against you unless they want me to. With how this all went, you can be sure that members have changed perspectives of you, so it's never going to be the same anyway. Presumably, at some point, you'll return to the Discord. But seeing as you haven't changed and probably won't, arguments will flare up again, fights will flare up again. And then what? Strike one, strike two, strike three? FdL forcefully removed from the region?

I translated the idiom to French using Google Translate: Garde l'honneur pour toi. So FdL, garde l'honneur pour toi and leave on your own accord with your head held high. Do that and you'll gain some actual respect from me. 

You're free to respond to this but take note that I won't respond back as I do not feel any further conversation between us would end up positive and productive.

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Het Huisselant Variota
Factbook | Nasionale TeleSicht | Character list | Varinco

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