Discussion: Nuke Arsenals

[Europa]

Owkey, what went wrong in that thread? Please be civil. Constructive critisism!!

[Fleet Admiral Connor Grey]

The Chosen Nations' position was singular and did not allow for compromise.

 

Nations suggested that he not land nuclear weapons on Island #122. He allowed for nuclear weapons inspectors but had no intentions of stopping plans.

 

Region security identified as threatened. Several nations cut off diplomatic ties with The Chosen Nations.

 

Difficulties in understanding lead to an all-out assault by The Chosen Nations on several of Europa's nations, shortly thereafter all threads were closed.

 

-----

 

All we asked for was some sensible Role-Playing. We warned about God moding that was present, and gave other warnings to try and help The Chosen Nations. All nations responded as any real nation would to such a quick nuclear threat.

[Mongol-Swedes]

I'd simply like to add that I made an effort to talk the guy behind TCN (OOC-wise) into playing this situation out a little better, but to no avail.

[Tagmatium Rules]

Well, the thread did start out as a genuine attempt to learn more about the nuclear weaponry of neighbouring nations. Some nations did not like the prying, and, this mixed with previous moves, such as the CDC (which I thought as amusing) and the annexation of the island (not illegal in RP/Map rules terms) the mild annoyance with the Chosen Nations' policies came to ahead. This did involve some God-modding (acting without consensus from other nations, ie attacking without giving another nation a chance to respond, etc), which could be considered to include the Byzancium thing. I do personally thing this is a reasonable expanation for why TCN has nuclear weaponry.

 

EDIT: let's not turn this into a b*tch-fest, ja?

Edited August 27, 2005 by Tagmatium Rules (see edit history)

[Akiiryu]

MS, a number of us did.

 

I still consider the nuke explanation extremely questionable at best. Using puppets that way is a little dodgy and bad rp in my books.

 

Most problematically, and I mean no offence to TCN, has been the TCN players constant attempts to act like a super power when the TCN is not one. The size, unfortunately, does matter and TCN doesn't match up. Diplomatically speaking, the TCN's problems have been their own making.

[Tagmatium Rules]

It's possibly no different to when I said that the "Ilia" got downed in the 1980's as an explanation as to why I have laser cannon to play with, or when I have given the empty plots names, rather than plot 21 or plot 19 or whatever. Hey, that's why my UN Puppet is called "Prousa", named after one of the "Principalities of the Borean" which I took over when I got the plot next to Karthenia and Corona Borealis (Orioni's plot).

[Akiiryu]

I understand what you're saying, but nukes are nukes and should be roll played (IMO). You did roll play the whole Ilia thing.

[Tagmatium Rules]

But you could say that a larger nation that has languished in the Pacifics for a while, say 50 million+, could also arrive in Europa. They could then later declare that they have nukes. Would they then have to go through the process of RPing the development of these weapons? The GHET doesn't have them (I've said so before and I disagree with any WMD's use), would I have to RP their development, even though I have 1.4 Billion+ little Tagmatines running around with in my borders?

[Akiiryu]

Technically, yes, they would. Especially if they had stated, like the GHET, they were aginst them. In some cases it might be reasonable for a large country to state it had them (extreme military expenditures and stuff). It comes down to realism. It simply was not realistic for TCN to have nukes, nor was rp explanation realistic.

[Ide Jima]

I think that maybe the total number of nukes a nation possesses could be useful if released, nothing else is given away such as the location and size, and it would avoid confusion (also make the nuclear deterrent a more predominant factor in RPs).

 

 

[Vanarambaion]

AHHHH! Where did that come from?! TCN has not been in the region long enough to get an understanding of his neighbors and their tendencies and capabilities. We never occupy a nation, we just generally ask for a change of government when we win a war. With the launch of nukes, you'd better believe nations like Vanarambaion would be sitting in the TCN capital for a long time to come. He moved too quickly, with too little knowledge of his neighbors in the region.

[Mongol-Swedes]

Not a bad idea, Ide Jima-dude. The Russians and Americans know how many each side has (although Russian numbers are likely to be somewhat inaccurate, with some Russian generals going rogue and turning their bases into arms dealer dens).

 

And neither side is declaring where their stuff is at (either officially or on the 'channels'), although there's always a little cloak-and-dagger stuff going on between 'em, naturally.

[The Chosen Nations]

I think that maybe the total number of nukes a nation possesses could be useful if released, nothing else is given away such as the location and size, and it would avoid confusion (also make the nuclear deterrent a more predominant factor in RPs).

Which is exactly what i sed!

[Akiiryu]

A number of nations would refuse. Very time in the past Akiiryu has been asked to provide such info it has said no,

[Vanarambaion]

I would still refuse. The number of nukes I own is plenty, I assure you, but when nations start releasing those numbers, they catch political flak from other corners - environmentalists, opposition politicians, the media, etc. Vanarambaion looks to avoid flak whenever possible

[The Chosen Nations]

I was kinda stupid, but my nation was feeling seriously thretened. I knew that I could never win, but my goal was to kill as many Civilians as I could, to make you see my message, I will not lay donw and die. Surrender would have made me look weak, the war made me look stupid, I chosen stupidity, with a side order of courage. And some insanity to go please.

 

Oh! That dustbin beat me at chess AGAIN!

[Mongol-Swedes]

Anyway, I just have a question to ask..........what does everyone think of my strategies?

[The Chosen Nations]

Are you that self-obsessed?

[Mongol-Swedes]

Not really, no. I am genuinely interested in feedback, because I am getting ready to go to Officer Canidate (sp?) School, where my knowledge of strategy and tactics will be tested.

[Europa]

please, no trolling..

[Akiiryu]

TCN,

 

There had been repeated attempts to get you out of the position in which you had placed your nation (you have a wonderful skill of making enemies). You need to work on your diplomacy skills at the very least. Both Tag and I presented you with face saving measures - IC and OOC - that would not have made your nation look weak. You ignored them. The ultimate result, which I stopped by suspending the RP, would have the complete destruction of your nation. Simply put, you probably would have lost the ability to RP that nation.

 

You also need to stop attacking/trolling OOC

[Mongol-Swedes]

Complete destruction of TCN? Not necessarily...if the actual shooting had stopped soon after the commando raids, the industrial and commercial side of things would 've been spared.

 

Oh, and, by the way, was the ENTIRE thread declared null and void? I am still wishing to maintain my carrier group off the west coast of my coast, since I am planning to expand into Plot 130 (albiet I will not be using explodng B-29's ).

Edited August 27, 2005 by Social Alliance Of Mongol-Swedes (see edit history)

[Akiiryu]

I am prepared to start the rp to back before TCN launched. Others will have to agree.

 

I was, btw, referring to his launch. The response - conventional or otherwise - from Akiiryu, Vanarambaion and Ide Jima would have flattened TCN

[The Chosen Nations]

Yes, I agree it would.

Please remind me whan Van offered me a diplomatic soultio. All he offered was war, and you want along, disregarding peaceful talkst, just because you were "old allies". I would have been happy to be monitored, and that was the way the talks were goins, until Van ruined them all.

[Tagmatium Rules]

Yes, I agree it would.

Please remind me when Van offered me a diplomatic soultion. All he offered was war, and you want along, disregarding peaceful talks, just because you were "old allies". I would have been happy to be monitored, and that was the way the talks were going, until Van ruined them all.

I'm trying to find it as well, but, bloody hell, if there isn't five plus threads about the same thing, which does add to the confusion. Van's posts are down to a minimum within the RPs, so it shouldn't be hard to find them.